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	<title>Comments on: 05-10-19</title>
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	<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/</link>
	<description>Promoting Science and Critical Thinking</description>
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		<title>By: Eugene Limpin</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-4067</link>
		<dc:creator>Eugene Limpin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Aug 2011 07:06:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-4067</guid>
		<description>External proofs can easily be resolved by Science. Such as causal connections, correlations, and deductive validity. But man cannot find answers to his own self-actions by a fraction of a second or in the present moment. It can only be done through critical investigation, it would probably mean to take time and think things-out but humans find themselves to lack that time even though it is evident that they possess it and as even Bertrand Russell noted, &quot;Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so&quot;. Critical thinking also means by that taking the most reasonable claim an issue or an argument can muster. Therefore, I find good reason for why Dalai Lama mentioned Science because it is a tool to discover the nature of reality through critical investigations whether claims of Religion or Spirituality has substantial proof. 

And by that let me take it further, that he meant reality not dogmatic is the purpose of Spirituality. For reality can only be measured or evaluated when critically investigated and it can provide enlightenment or openness of thinking that most Religions which are dogmatic do not commit to and through the recommendation of the Dalai Lama that they should now commit to. But Science or critical investigation also has its down-side because when radically enforced turns into what Dalai Lama feared, and that is already a sign of dogmatism on the part of critical thinkers because it reduces everything and becomes a form of nihilism. 

So all in all, it needs a balance. What are needed are proofs. Not dogmatism, reductionism or nihilism. Dalai Lama simply tries to express that we need proofs and not Scientific reductionism that turns into a nihilist ideology and that Religion should not be dogmatic.

On the other side of the review, I was really disappointed when you (the reviewer) mentioned a Straw Fallacy. I hardly find an idea or expression a straw fallacy when you express it on your own point of view. You as the reviewer seemed to have a prejudiced idea or notion about Science that you attacked Dalai Lama&#039;s expression as a Straw Fallacy. According to Walton&#039;s thesis that Straw Fallacies are committed when there is a shift from a type or context of dialogue to another(also presented in his thesis) which can be found here: http://www.dougwalton.ca/. Since he is expressing his own insight and not performing any dispute (symmetrical dialogue) or dissent (assymetrical dialogue) that I find your review a little bit guilty on bias and therefore, faulty in reasoning. The fault seems to be that you presented you own argument in the review and thus changed the context of an author-reader expression into a dispute. It is because you already have a view that you took it on the side of Science and praised it wholeheartedly that you&#039;ve failed to consider what he is expressing and that is the Science and Religion thesis. 

Overall, I would like to thank you for the enlightening review since there are pojnts which are really good. The Karma and God part of the review is one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>External proofs can easily be resolved by Science. Such as causal connections, correlations, and deductive validity. But man cannot find answers to his own self-actions by a fraction of a second or in the present moment. It can only be done through critical investigation, it would probably mean to take time and think things-out but humans find themselves to lack that time even though it is evident that they possess it and as even Bertrand Russell noted, &#8220;Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so&#8221;. Critical thinking also means by that taking the most reasonable claim an issue or an argument can muster. Therefore, I find good reason for why Dalai Lama mentioned Science because it is a tool to discover the nature of reality through critical investigations whether claims of Religion or Spirituality has substantial proof. </p>
<p>And by that let me take it further, that he meant reality not dogmatic is the purpose of Spirituality. For reality can only be measured or evaluated when critically investigated and it can provide enlightenment or openness of thinking that most Religions which are dogmatic do not commit to and through the recommendation of the Dalai Lama that they should now commit to. But Science or critical investigation also has its down-side because when radically enforced turns into what Dalai Lama feared, and that is already a sign of dogmatism on the part of critical thinkers because it reduces everything and becomes a form of nihilism. </p>
<p>So all in all, it needs a balance. What are needed are proofs. Not dogmatism, reductionism or nihilism. Dalai Lama simply tries to express that we need proofs and not Scientific reductionism that turns into a nihilist ideology and that Religion should not be dogmatic.</p>
<p>On the other side of the review, I was really disappointed when you (the reviewer) mentioned a Straw Fallacy. I hardly find an idea or expression a straw fallacy when you express it on your own point of view. You as the reviewer seemed to have a prejudiced idea or notion about Science that you attacked Dalai Lama&#8217;s expression as a Straw Fallacy. According to Walton&#8217;s thesis that Straw Fallacies are committed when there is a shift from a type or context of dialogue to another(also presented in his thesis) which can be found here: <a href="http://www.dougwalton.ca/" rel="nofollow">http://www.dougwalton.ca/</a>. Since he is expressing his own insight and not performing any dispute (symmetrical dialogue) or dissent (assymetrical dialogue) that I find your review a little bit guilty on bias and therefore, faulty in reasoning. The fault seems to be that you presented you own argument in the review and thus changed the context of an author-reader expression into a dispute. It is because you already have a view that you took it on the side of Science and praised it wholeheartedly that you&#8217;ve failed to consider what he is expressing and that is the Science and Religion thesis. </p>
<p>Overall, I would like to thank you for the enlightening review since there are pojnts which are really good. The Karma and God part of the review is one.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Huber</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-2451</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Huber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2010 03:59:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-2451</guid>
		<description>I just started this book and liked it at first, then ran into the part as stated by Shermer &quot;filling in the gaps with god&quot; and am disappointed also.  I will read the rest of it, but see the Dalai Lama&#039;s bias already, and am impressed that he stated that &quot;Bhuddism must accept the facts&quot; which I doubt we will hear anytime soon from any Pope.

Thanks Michael Shermer for your eloquent review of this book.
Mike Huber</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just started this book and liked it at first, then ran into the part as stated by Shermer &#8220;filling in the gaps with god&#8221; and am disappointed also.  I will read the rest of it, but see the Dalai Lama&#8217;s bias already, and am impressed that he stated that &#8220;Bhuddism must accept the facts&#8221; which I doubt we will hear anytime soon from any Pope.</p>
<p>Thanks Michael Shermer for your eloquent review of this book.<br />
Mike Huber</p>
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		<title>By: Christian Copley</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-2429</link>
		<dc:creator>Christian Copley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Oct 2010 16:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-2429</guid>
		<description>&quot;Scientists are not always seekers after objective truth as they claim.They often allow political correctness to trump truth.&quot;

What nonscientific method was used to discover this? Did the &#039;reveal&#039; of this fact come from Cthulu?

&quot;Scientists are as corruptible as anyone else. Case closed.&quot;

Too bad your brain shut off so quickly. No one has said scientists are not corruptible (straw man). The problem is that science is a mechanism, not a person. It is designed to weed out bias and corruption as a natural course. None of your examples were discovered by magic. They were discovered because science is not lashed to the corruptibility of a human. Scientists distrust each other more than you do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Scientists are not always seekers after objective truth as they claim.They often allow political correctness to trump truth.&#8221;</p>
<p>What nonscientific method was used to discover this? Did the &#8216;reveal&#8217; of this fact come from Cthulu?</p>
<p>&#8220;Scientists are as corruptible as anyone else. Case closed.&#8221;</p>
<p>Too bad your brain shut off so quickly. No one has said scientists are not corruptible (straw man). The problem is that science is a mechanism, not a person. It is designed to weed out bias and corruption as a natural course. None of your examples were discovered by magic. They were discovered because science is not lashed to the corruptibility of a human. Scientists distrust each other more than you do.</p>
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		<title>By: Herman King</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-1401</link>
		<dc:creator>Herman King</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Feb 2010 14:55:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-1401</guid>
		<description>Scientists are not always seekers after objective truth as they claim.They often allow political correctness to trump truth. Examples: Kennewick Man which proves Asiatics are not the original native Americans, the MRI scans which proved King Tut an European, and the firing of Dr. James Watson for stating the simple and obvious fact that Sub Sahara blacks aren&#039;t as smart as Europeans. Scientists are as corruptible as anyone else. Case closed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scientists are not always seekers after objective truth as they claim.They often allow political correctness to trump truth. Examples: Kennewick Man which proves Asiatics are not the original native Americans, the MRI scans which proved King Tut an European, and the firing of Dr. James Watson for stating the simple and obvious fact that Sub Sahara blacks aren&#8217;t as smart as Europeans. Scientists are as corruptible as anyone else. Case closed.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-1020</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Dec 2009 23:54:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-1020</guid>
		<description>The term &#039;karma&#039; seems to be problematic and misunderstood for several reasons. First of all karma means &#039;cause and effect&#039; or &#039;action&#039; and nothing else. It is nothing mystical and nothing unobservable. However, it has been borrowed and overloaded with unintended meaning by virtually everybody, especially New Age sweet-farts so it became almost as blurry as the term &#039;electricity&#039;.

Karma is not necessarily tied to reincarnation at all. It functions here and now. The whole problem with reincarnation arises because it really doesn&#039;t make sense if you have that funny idea that there is something that reincarnates, which Buddhism clearly rejects. There are only causes and effects and it is simply as stupid to believe in the first cause as it is to believe in the last, isolated effect.

Of course there is an ongoing scientific debate on the nature of consciousness which affects potential scope of the problem. I recommend reading works of David Chalmers and criticisms by Daniel Dennett and others to draw your own conclusions. Personally, I think that most materialistically biased thinkers (especially those from the atheist-brights camp) either don&#039;t grok the very core of the so-called hard problem of consciousness or are inconsequent in their criticisms.

The word is often used in the context of &#039;having good or bad karma&#039;. But again it means nothing mysterious, especially it doesn&#039;t mean that karma &#039;exists&#039; in any way. It is more like a notion of situation that one has worked out through a series of causes and whether this yields a liberating or limiting position. Karma doesn&#039;t imply determinism because you can always re-route the action just as you can choose to wiggle your toe or not right now. I find Buddhism to be the only one so far to deliver naturalistic and logical ground for ethical behavior.

I think that Buddhism being a consequent method to achieve well-defined liberation and enlightenment deserves a better criticism than presented in this article and other alike.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The term &#8216;karma&#8217; seems to be problematic and misunderstood for several reasons. First of all karma means &#8217;cause and effect&#8217; or &#8216;action&#8217; and nothing else. It is nothing mystical and nothing unobservable. However, it has been borrowed and overloaded with unintended meaning by virtually everybody, especially New Age sweet-farts so it became almost as blurry as the term &#8216;electricity&#8217;.</p>
<p>Karma is not necessarily tied to reincarnation at all. It functions here and now. The whole problem with reincarnation arises because it really doesn&#8217;t make sense if you have that funny idea that there is something that reincarnates, which Buddhism clearly rejects. There are only causes and effects and it is simply as stupid to believe in the first cause as it is to believe in the last, isolated effect.</p>
<p>Of course there is an ongoing scientific debate on the nature of consciousness which affects potential scope of the problem. I recommend reading works of David Chalmers and criticisms by Daniel Dennett and others to draw your own conclusions. Personally, I think that most materialistically biased thinkers (especially those from the atheist-brights camp) either don&#8217;t grok the very core of the so-called hard problem of consciousness or are inconsequent in their criticisms.</p>
<p>The word is often used in the context of &#8216;having good or bad karma&#8217;. But again it means nothing mysterious, especially it doesn&#8217;t mean that karma &#8216;exists&#8217; in any way. It is more like a notion of situation that one has worked out through a series of causes and whether this yields a liberating or limiting position. Karma doesn&#8217;t imply determinism because you can always re-route the action just as you can choose to wiggle your toe or not right now. I find Buddhism to be the only one so far to deliver naturalistic and logical ground for ethical behavior.</p>
<p>I think that Buddhism being a consequent method to achieve well-defined liberation and enlightenment deserves a better criticism than presented in this article and other alike.</p>
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		<title>By: Marlow</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-903</link>
		<dc:creator>Marlow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 20:15:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-903</guid>
		<description>It is important to acknowledge that &quot;karma&quot; takes in a great many Buddhist and Hindu traditions. In Tibetan Buddhism karma is tied to reincarnation, which, granted, is incompatible with a positivist world view. In other traditions it is more a law of cause and effect, completely compatible with positivism, empiricism, etc.; its oddity inheres only in its nature as a *moral* law of cause and effect. It&#039;s disingenuous to draw conclusions about Buddhism based only on Tibetan Buddhism. That&#039;s like drawing conclusions about predestination by reference only to Calvinism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is important to acknowledge that &#8220;karma&#8221; takes in a great many Buddhist and Hindu traditions. In Tibetan Buddhism karma is tied to reincarnation, which, granted, is incompatible with a positivist world view. In other traditions it is more a law of cause and effect, completely compatible with positivism, empiricism, etc.; its oddity inheres only in its nature as a *moral* law of cause and effect. It&#8217;s disingenuous to draw conclusions about Buddhism based only on Tibetan Buddhism. That&#8217;s like drawing conclusions about predestination by reference only to Calvinism.</p>
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		<title>By: JJ</title>
		<link>http://www.skeptic.com/eskeptic/05-10-19/#comment-707</link>
		<dc:creator>JJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 13:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.skeptic.com/eSkeptic/?p=491#comment-707</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a buddhist and I would like to think that most of us, where it can be positively proved that the notion of karma is false would accept the result. One of the teachings of the Buddha is to critically assess our beliefs. Enlightenment is about finding the truth to choose to be blind to it would mean we never sought it in the beginning. Personally, I have chosen to &quot;believe&quot; in karma until it can be proven to not exist (1) to be an example, because i believe that if we all acted in this way, the world would be a &quot;pure land&quot; and (2) it makes misfortune easier to accept paving the way to more energy to resolve difficult situations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a buddhist and I would like to think that most of us, where it can be positively proved that the notion of karma is false would accept the result. One of the teachings of the Buddha is to critically assess our beliefs. Enlightenment is about finding the truth to choose to be blind to it would mean we never sought it in the beginning. Personally, I have chosen to &#8220;believe&#8221; in karma until it can be proven to not exist (1) to be an example, because i believe that if we all acted in this way, the world would be a &#8220;pure land&#8221; and (2) it makes misfortune easier to accept paving the way to more energy to resolve difficult situations.</p>
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